According to few members that attended the above meeting, it was actually a discussion and Q&A session. It concluded that to form up a committee to share the cost for hiring lawyer for legal action. They will try to gather all the YZ members as a group to collect petition and send out formal letters to appeal for refund and stop the bank installments. However, some of them said that most probably it is impossible to get a refund, so they planned to fight for a change in management and get someone to take over.
New Investor & YZ Member Representatives Meeting at Plaza Damas Outlet on 8th Sep 2008 (Mon)
As I know, this meeting is held at Plaza Damas outlet @ 3:00pm and only opened for the member representatives. However, have no idea who are the representatives. I believe it should be fine if yogababy and anonymous (plrulz82@gmail.com) volunteer to attend as been told that can invite few members as representatives for this meeting. I wish to attend but couldn’t make it. So, would appreciate both of you help to voice out the members’ doubts and queries as listed below and update us thereafter.
New Investor & YZ Member Representatives Meeting at Kepong Outlet on 9th Sep 2008 (Mon)
Joshua is being kind to inform that there will be a meeting with member representatives as well at Kepong outlet on the following day after Plaza Damas on 9th Sep 2008 (Tue) @ 11:00am. He emphasized that only appointed member representatives can attend but didn’t mention who they are. Hope Joshua and those attended representatives can update us as well after the meeting and also raise the same concerns as other members.
Common Doubts and Queries from Members
Below are the summary of the concerns that emailed by some of the members:
- Which are the outlets will be taken over by the new investors and how long would it take? At least members will know whether should they continue to wait or look for alternatives if their outlet will definitely be closed, although they willing to pay the RM88 fees.
- Now only 4 outlets conducting classes (Puchong, Kepong, Taman Deas and The Weld) and how long would it be sustained as noticed classes are getting lesser?
- Is this RM88 payable on monthly basis deal to the investor, NOT the installment scheme to the bankers anymore?
- Is this RM88 a long term special rate for the existing YZ members or just for a short grace period?
- Can the new investor kindly consider to waive the fees for the existing YZ members for a grace period (may be a year or whatever suggestion as a gesture of goodwill to maintain the YZ members), especially for those GC members that still paying heavy installments to the banks?
- Someone has posted a comment which highlighted and reminded something. Anonymous commented on 7th Sep @ 8:45am on my previous post: “I remember read from sin chew last month that TJ is apply to set aside the receivership on September and the hearing is on 12th September, this Friday. Lay Gaik said that the investor will come in on 15th September, the problem is, what if TJ had successfully set aside the receivership? Then receivers have to get out of the company and TJ is back to control, then will this investor works with TJ?”
What will happen if TJ really successfully set aside the receivership and doesn’t want to work with this new investor? So, would it be better that the new membership fees collection of RM88 will only take effect after the outcome from the court? - Would it possible the Receiver to call for a meeting to update the members about the status so that won’t leave us in the dark. At least meeting with some representatives if they worry it would cause havoc if all the members attend and attack by asking 1001 questions…. (This query ONLY IF the Receiver is attended the meeting).
Hope those representatives that attending the meeting tomorrow or Tue at Kepong, can help to raise the above concerns. THANK YOU.
39 comments:
hi yogalover
i know one of the representatives who will be attending the meeting at damas today. have asked her to raise the questions highlighted in your blog during the meeting. will keep you all updated when i receive any info from her.
Hi Karin,
Many thanks for your kind effort and help. Really hope today's meeting is effective and can answer members' concerns.
hi yogalover,
jz wondering do u sign up with other centre at the moment? i've no confident in YZ at all. now still waiting... thot the closure of certain outlets will lead to increase of no. of classes at those remaining outlet, but it doesn't. sad...
yday i passed by tmn desa outlet, the red paint still there.
Hi cutiecate,
I have the same thought as you. I plan to sign up with Life Yoga at Cheras (setup by Sharon, YZ ex-teacher) while waiting the outcome from the new investor as RM88 is still the best price if they provide the same facilities and teachers. The fee there is quite expensive compared to YZ but I may sign up for a month first as not practicing yoga/pilates for quite some weeks already. Will check on their Sep/Oct schedule first as the Aug timetable seems not really suit to me (limited class option, only 4 classes a day).
Currently, I go to California Fitness (CF) on every Sat for an hour workout but still prefer yoga(no choice now). Don't really feel want to join the yoga classes at CF, no idea why or may be use to the YZ teachers' style.
Hi Yoga Lover / Representatives,
Still waiting outcome of the meeting at Plaza Damas, any update? Thanks!
Best regards,
I really admire you all who still can sign up for another yoga package.
I still have 12 months instalment to pay for my GC package fee. This really burn a big hole in my pocket.
I'm praying everyday yc classes still can continues, no matter how bad the situation is. (I practice in yc puchong now without electricity and water. Condition really bad, practice yoga in the dark and smelly toilet, can't drink much water b4 class coz no toilet can be used, no shower and straight go to work after the morning class) But still, i don't mind at all, as long as there are classes for me to attend.
If yc no more classes, I can only do the home practice for 1 year. I will sign up a package again one year later..
I went to Nicole's class at Damas yesterday afternoon. Nicole said she dare not open Tmn Desa's studio yesterday morning as the place was splashed with red paint, so there was no class in the morning at Tmn Desa. Think the paint was newly splashed yesterday morning.
Yogalover, may I know how much is the subscription fee at California Fitness?
hi yogalover,
i'm now thinking of want to join One Yoga or not... as now even Tmn Desa oso not much choice n the time not suit me. Serena, Leric, Christy and Ken are at One Yoga now, but they teach limited classes only. their fees is around rm150/mth, not tat cheap lo! especially now the bank still charging me installment, huhuhu....
i went to California Fitness for trial class b4. attended their yoga class once. sad to say... i don like their style ~ teacher perform on the stage.
heard no investor interested to buy tmn desa outlet... is that true? like that cham loooo.....
My friend working in damas told me that damas main entrance was sticked with lots of paper in Malay language, she suspects the outlet was sealed, is that true?
I just received a bad news, the management decided to stop all the classes for puchong, the weld and taman desa effective from 9/9/08.
Goodbye to all my beloved teachers and members. Pls remember to continue practice yoga. No class for yc now, I will continue self practice at home.
Namaste.
Does anyone know what is happening to The Weld outlet? Is it closed down for good? I thot Ms Lim Lay Gaik (through Yogalover's message on 5 Sept 2008) said otherwise? Really hope the receiver can update us.
I also recall in the "YZ Receivership Update" dated 27 Aug 2008, the receiver would try to keep the minimum classes ongoing while the proposal with the new investor is being finalised. Pls, pls update us, whether it's good or bad news! We just need to know; rather than hanging around wondering whether to sign up elsewhere.
Noticed there are about 8 classes scheduled for tmrw at Kepong. Why not The Weld or other outlets? If The Weld is not going to be salvaged - we need to know! Don't want to hang around wondering in the dark!
Dear Fei,
The closure of taman desa is it permanently or just temporary until the new investor takes over? Or is the new investor totally not interested in taman desa outlet? if so then its really sad since taman desa is the very first YZ outlet.Dear teachers ( ex and current), :)have u guys ever consider renting this taman desa outlet and opening ur very own studio? wouldnt this be a great idea as the location is ideal and u already have members who are willing to come join u? This would be a dream come true!
( Anonymous, 7th sept 11.06pm - closure of cheras)
Oooppps - just saw Fei's message - the answer to all my questions!
BTW - Fei, can you give some pointers on how to practice yoga at home? Do you follow a set routine or based on video?
Well, as much as I can update on the meeting held at Plaza Damas today, it is all just verbal Q&A.
There were 5 members from P.D. & of course me, well, representing Weld & I did print out your questions, so Cheras members too.
Ms.Lay Gaik & the "new investor" ("NI") answered the questions amicably & listened attentively & took in some suggestions proposed.
Answers to questions that is lingering in everyone's mind:-
1) Of course the $$$$$. Please forget about getting a refund to whatever fees you have paid as its between you & YZ. It seems some members has filed with Tribunal court & court has ordered YZ to refund, but how?? We, unfortunately lies right at the bottom of the list, after paying staff's outstanding salaries, EPF, Income tax, creditors. So, go and pay RM10 to file with tribunal court & wait for your refund which make take years.
2) Definately NI is not refunding us the paid amount. Which businessman with a sane mind would do that. However, existing members will be entitled to a special rate of RM88/mth effective 1st Oct 08 for a period of 1 yr.
We then negotiate further for GC members, NI proposed RM88/mth for duration of 3 yrs. GC members present seemed pleased with this proposal.
Those holding vouchers are also entitled to this special rate of RM88/mth for 1 yr.
Non-members (this also applies for those members' package that has expired recently, that means no current/valid membership) has to pay either RM138 or RM150.
To be entitled to this special rate, you will need to show your receipt that you still have a valid membership. Membership will be free flow to all clubs that is still operating.
We also asked about those that has signed up for teachers' training-NI/LG said that they will try to make special arrangement to continue to provide those that has signed up for TTC.
2) I asked who are we paying the RM88 to??? The RM88 will be paid to the NI. I also questioned the NI's credibility. Well, they are from a well established family business (which I will not mention who just as yet)
3) NI has just renewed lease with P.Damas landlord, therefore, it will continue to have classes. They're also keeping Kepong branch. They do have intention to keep CP, however, has not come to a mutual understanding with the l/lord. Hardluck for The Weld, S.P, as from the sound of it, NI may not proceed with renewing lease at these places as there is outstanding rental of 3-4 months!!
Pls chk YZ's website for classes.
4) Yes,they confirmed that TJ did file to throw out the receivership. NI said it will not effect the new business/branches as the lease is signed with a new owner & new club.
I hope I have answered everyone's queries. Should you all have further questions, please call the manager at Plaza Damas-Ms Esther & Kepong - Miss Lillian.
I must say that Ms.Lay Gaik seems like a nice lady trying her best to take care of member's need. But anyway, its just my opinion.
We also further suggested that to put up a suggestion box for member's queries.
They will be renovating the centres in stages as they want to continue operation & provide classes on a daily basis. P.Damas should have the water supply back by tomorrow, but I suggest to bring your own mat & towel as I hear that it's filthy as the moment.
So, member's please continue to practise Yoga (for free, technically till 1st Oct) at P.Damas & Kepong.
Without prejudice.
Dear IMY,
I only received this closure info from a yoga teacher, she doesn't know any further info. I feel that chances are slim for the investor to take over these yc now.
Dear Anonymous (September 8, 2008 6:49 PM), are you practice at home too? I have a couples of yoga dvd discs and books as refer to practice. If you have broadband internet, you can go to www.yogatoday.com site to get daily yoga video to practice.
Hi Yogababy,
Many thanks for your kindness in helping to raise our concerns and your speedy update.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Hi Hello Kitty,
I signed up California Fitness at a special corporate rate to our company during the Chinese New Year which only valid for 1 year cost less than RM1k (can't recall the actualy amount, I think about RM700+). But I had been approached and convinced it was a need to sign up at least 12 sessions of Personal Training (1 hour each session) @ about RM1,500+ which really not worth that. My trainer extremely not punctual and can't see any passion to his job. They are really far behind compare to the YZ teachers.
Thanks for your update yogababy.
i am abit confuse. you mean even we are existing member we still have to pay 88/month?
Hi Inez
Yes, RM88/mth for a year for all existing members that has a yearly membership & RM88/mth for 3 yrs for GC members.
But nothing is in papers yet, so just wait for NI to announce.
Hi Yogababy,
Thanks for your update. Gosh... I'm one of the member from CP. just join YZ for 3 months. really bad luck ... :(
I don't think the new investor should take the words of the few members representatives as the voice of all members.
Personally I don't think RM88 makes sense even though it may be cheaper than other centers, but we members are also the victim here and should not continue to be kept in the dark and pay blindly again.
I think they should not request the members to pay until they can earn back our trust.. many of us are still paying for the installments!!
Thanks, Yogababy, for sharing the news on YZ. I have finally given up hope on YZ. For those who keep saying "I told you so" - never mind! I can live with it. YZ is not dead actually, but it's just not convenient for me to go to Kepong or Damas outlets. It's unfortunate that they hv ditched The Weld outlet. My money (for unexpired membership) has gone down the drain!
Thanks, Yogalover and Cuticate for sharing your experience at CF. I doubt I will sign up at CF. Another YZ member (ex now I guess) told me that CF came across as a place just for ppl to hang out for fun and not for serious yoga practitioners. There's not been a single positive comment abt CF. Sigh ....
Will try home practice like Fei. Thanks Fei, for sharing the link to yogatoday.com. It will never be the same, though - imagine yoga practice in the midst of dogs' barking, neighbours' talking loudly, noise from the kitchen and TV etc etc. It's gonna take a lot of discipline.
hello kitty,
I agree with you, i am also not keen in attending yoga classes offered by the fitness centres as it seems like some/most of the people who go there just want to be "seen" and to "look" at others.
Will try out other yoga centres closer to home, my only regret is not practising yoga sooner in YZ.
Dear yogababy,
In the meeting at plaza damas today, did the investors mention anything abt taman desa outlet?Are they keeping the outlet or letting it go?
I too have just paid RM1,800 in April & has not utilized the membership as I had free passes & still have to pay monthly installment for the next 9 mths!!!!
Well, just wait & see after several months with the new owner if you are not confident with the set-up (I mean I am also at the same position as everyone else). Why pay more when we've already paid??? But which business men is crazy to take over a business in heavy debt of, I heard RM2mil & try to make everything right, or revive the club,& make a loss, leh?? Would you?? In the meantime, practise at home or like I suggested earlier, get a group & hire a teacher to teach private classes. Not all teachers has a job as they are only hiring abt 20 teachers. so, go do something rather than sit & cry over split milk. Or join other club for a few months until everything is settled at the new "YZ" or old "YZ.
Some people dare to rob in day light without conscience.....
LIFE goes on.....
Tmn Desa outlet-sorry I can't remember clearly if whether the NI said he's negotiating with the landlord. But for certain only 2 clubs are open now - Plaza Damas & kepong.
I know they've classes tmr in PD in the morning, 1 & 3pm by felix. & evening classes. took note of 1 & 3pm classes only as i practice that time, sorry :).Call the branch to enquire
Lay Gaik is a shareholder of YZ and with the new investor, she will recover her investment (RM650k or more-figure stated in the forum). Are we still giving money to her while our existing membership fees are "conned"? How can a shareholder of a busted company recover her investment while creditors like us suffer? We should not buy the story by investing the monthly RM88. The receivership is just to buy time and con the members! The new outfit will be run or own partially by her. Unless of course we are willing to be conned again. We should not let business people going around cheating people's hard earned money by closing and reopening a different outfit to escape their debt obligations.
If they are charging existing members rm88 per month and since there are less operating outlets now,I hope they will increase the number of classes everyday coz no one is going to be pleased not being able to attend classes and being told " sorry the class is full!" after paying rm88 again.
If the Company has no money to refund our membership fees, then we should go after the Directors of the Company. Technically the Directors had commited CRIME, YZ had already started facing financial difficulty one year ago, rental & creditors not paid, owed teachers' fees and staff salaries, EPF, Income Tax, Socso etc etc. The Directors knew the financial position of YZ very well, knew YZ has no way to survive BUT still keep actively promoting and taking in members' money, what is this called? DAYTIME ROBBERY!!! The Company have no money but the directors have, lets go all out & sue them!!!
Hi Anonymous (8th Sep @ 9:58pm),
It is no offence but only my opinion:
- First of all, the main shareholder of YZ is TJ (89%) and not Lay Gaik no doubt she is the 10% shareholder. But as understood from Jess' blog with an attached document that she was already been stopped/ordered not joining the board since Apr 2007, so wonder she knows what happening since then till the reciversip recently.
- I think we have the right and option not to choose to pay the RM88 as there are still many other yoga centers out there. But believe those willing to pay is because these members intend to continue practicing yoga and considering they can offer the same facilities and teachers at a cheaper rate. It is already different entity from YZ and regardless the existence of this new club, we may still have to look for else where to continue our yoga practice.
- Like Fei and few other members, they chose to practice at home as she is burdened with the GC installment and too bad the new investor doesn't consider to waive fee for a grace period for them but only offer special rate @ RM88 for 3 years which not all can afford at the moment while paying the installments.
- You may be right that even the new investor might not be sustained as YZ such a big company with 10 outlets can also owed such a huge debts and against the law by not paying the epf, socso and income tax. That's why some of us would only consider them as they only collected monthly fee compared to YZ at least RM1488+ yearly package and monthlt installment will tied up to the whole sum paid. If we find dissatisfy with the new club "Urban Yoga", we may just stop at the following month and won't end up being conned with the advance cash paid. I think it's fair but might not be the same for others.
- Since everyone keeps thinking Lay Gaik is part of the new investor and not fair on what she did, then just make another check on roc of this new company of "Urban Yoga" whethher she is one of the shareholder. Did the same on how previously checked on YZ directorship... Then, the doubt is cleared whether she is really like what everyone thougt or being accused... Any other better suggestion?
Don't want to argue this point anymore as we just concern about our yoga practice and a peaceful mind.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dear all Anonymous (unknow members),
As mentioned earlier in previous comment, appreciate if you could indicate your initial or nickname here after your comment, so that can recognise and address you correctly. THANK YOU.
I just want to practice yoga again under the guidance of good and friendly instructors in a comfy environment.Just a very simple wish but yet somehow seems hard to be fulfilled at this moment :(
Lay Gaik is all the while a valid and official director of YZ, she filed in constructive dismissal on march 2007 and since then suing all the rest of the directors till she got the receivership. This is a back-door tactics to 'invest' cheaply in a company. Imagine the facilities set up by the previous person, all the hardware is there for the investor just to press the RESET button and start over again with lowest capital. Is this an 'investment'?
I still think its a pity that TJ wasnt given a final opportunity to try to save YZ, afterall YZ was his baby and he was the one who nurtured and developd it. Now we will never know what could have been, and if receivership was the best soluttion.
Questions to Ni:
1. What's your estimated initial 'investment' to this take-over?
2. Who will be the head to lead and run your new yoga business? As we all know that most staff have left.
3. What's your vision and mission of Urban Yoga? A long term vision is definitely a must as I don't think that you know this business well.
4. Who are the confirmed teachers that will be in your team?
5. How many classes can you guarantee for each outlet? This is essential to ensure situation like now won't happen again, if we are paying, we are the boss, not the beggar.
6. Who will be the directors and shareholders of your new company? No one wants something like this happens again as any disputes arise among the directors or shareholders I'm the company, members will be victimized again.
7. What renovation/ upgrading work will be carried out? Timeline?
8. What's your exact background and back-up? Sorry, if you are only running your 'family business', I have no confident.
Yes, I am interested to know what are the hidden deal between NI and LG, I mean how much LG gets from NI via this so called "RESET back- door cheap investment"
Everyone must be reminded that this is a "SHAREHOLDER APPOINTED RECEIVERSHIP" based on a so called minority oppression. Unlike a creditor appointed receivership under a debenture, where the creditors like the members will loose everything. In the business world, your name does not need to appear on Form 24 or 49 to be the actual owner or shareholder. The current scenario clearly justified my assessment that it is just closing down a company(HEAVILY IN DEBT) to restart a new one. Members should not sue but report to the Commercial Crime for fraud on all the directors and shareholders. People should not encourage such unscrupulous business people from deceiving and cheating them again. She may have left in early 2007 as an executive director but it is for her to defend herself in the court of law since she is still the shareholder of YZ and this is a SHAREHOLDER APPOINTED RECEIVERSHIP. Being one of the shareholders she is still responsible for payments like EPF and Income Tax deducted from staff.
dear cheated,
you are right, but, I still couldn't understand the logic of the whole situation. In order to be out of the heavy debts, thr easiest way is to wind up thr company with Official Receiver, not the appointed private receiver. And also, the majority shareholder in all times can do this and not letting this minority shareholder taking the advantage. Or like Anwar case before, this is 'a high level of conspiracy'??? By pushing all the accusations to previous TJ and the tactful and right timing of receivership as well as the ganging up with the insiders , Lay Gaik not only can gain the public's sympathy as she was 'oppressed', but also nail TJ's reputation down at the same time. Don't forget that if the initial reason Lay Gaik told all of us for receivership was TJ had mismanaged the company and now? After receivership, she just find a way out by accusing ( again??? ) TJ has taken all the financial reports and papers in the company and they can check nothing, what a good 'escape clause' for the whole story!
It's truly a miracle that during the first teachers' meeting two days right after the receivership, the 'investor' immediately appear in front of us! Aren't the receivers supposed to study the company first before any proposal to the court? How can Lay Gaik and Ni like the fortune teller can predict these things to happen? The minority shareholders that Lay Gaik used to sued all turn tails and sided her, during the meeting, all of them appeared and supported Lay Gaik and were so closed to Lay Gaik, talking happily and ambitiously about the future 'business plan'! Ken, the pilates instructor, also the shareholder of the company sitting right beside Lay Gaik, ken's sister, stephanie chia, also the director, that had resigned and since then missing-in-action, were there to support too. Serena and Leric, the yoga instructor, was giving full support to Lay Gaik too, any deal behind this whole scene?
Every yoga practitioner pls take my advise not to join any fitness centres just because of yoga classes. The members in fitness centres are not real yoga practitioners. They only go for yoga once a week just to "calm their minds". They only know Warrior I,II, III, Trikonosana and some simple twisting. They don't do inversion and arm balancing. I really pity the yoga instructors who are teaching in the fitness centres cos they received many complaints from the members who think that inversion and arm balancing hurt their neck, shoulders, hands and fingers.
How about Sri Petaling branch?
Post a Comment